Face of Muhammad

[mud_]

one of twelve images that caused thousands of pre-evolution life forms to burn thousands of dollars worth of buildings and threaten lives:

http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/6337/2188/1600/kw.2.jpg

the rest can be found in any one of these links (probably): http://michellemalkin.com/archives/004446.htm

[Ellen Degenerate]

imagine if christians reacted the same way as this everytime something blasphemous was published against God or Jesus? the whole world would have been burned to ruin long ago.

[breastnorton]

i'm not visiting michelle malkin's website bro

that fuckin whore

[joydivision]

imagine if christians reacted the same way as this everytime something blasphemous was published against God or Jesus? the whole world would have been burned to ruin long ago.

for this see everytime christianity is painted in some unpleasent light. also see "God, The Devil, and Bob"

[Godless]

bob saget?

[KenKill75]

Muhammad = :shit:

[B]

That just shows how many muslims are unevolved, belligerant fucks.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f236/euphonae/p1.jpg

That is a great depiction of the muslim situation in the middle east.

[phi]

Maybe, but I think people shouldn't be so surprised with how it has sparked reaction from all over the world as it has. It would have been different if it was just a guy in a turban (that is, as a muslim person in general).

[B]

people shouldn't be surprised about the stupid-ass religious fanaticism around the world (completely specific to Islam and its primitive intolerance)

Do the same thing with a budda picture - I guarantee that Buddhists and Hindus will not spark any physical violence.

[mud_]

i would imagaine the dalai lama would have a laugh at a comical depiction of buddha...but then again, as far as i know, buddha has never encouraged the slaughter of millions of "infidels"

do you wonder if muslims ever step back and say to themselves " man, we REALLY have some fucked up beliefs"

i cant think of anything at all that would cause me to burn a building or to seriously threaten a life

sure, ive said shit like "i'll kill you" and "i wish he/she was dead" but its never been in a serious, go-out-and-arm-myself, plan-to-follow-through kind of threat

like someone said on one of those sites that i got the picture from: its becoming more and more clear that there is NO way that these fucking morons will ever be (and i hate to use the word) "assimilated" into a RELATIVELY peaceful society

[KenKill75]

Their reaction does nothing but show the truth behind the cartoon. They are basically giving validity to the stereotype. And they're too fucking stupid to even realize that. This is why they are referred to as sand blasted niggers.

[Modus Ponens]

But I thought it was a religion of peace...............

[KenKill75]

Thats what they'd like you to believe. Actions speak louder than words.

[KenKill75]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060207/ts_nm/religion_cartoons_dc

Ive never heard of anything so stupid in my life. Cartoon bloodshed. :shame: Blithering idiots.

[mud_]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060207/ts_nm/religion_cartoons_dc

Ive never heard of anything so stupid in my life. Cartoon bloodshed. :shame: Blithering idiots.

i know. that shit makes me angry as hell

i want to print up a hundred copies and send it to every mosque i can find the address of

no doubt though i'd be charged for inciting a riot or some other soft cock bullshit like that

edit- i should have looked at yor link first, i thought you referring to the three danes that were killed in afghanistan over the cartoons

[phi]

But I thought it was a religion of peace...............

I thought so too. Apparently a lot of its followers are suffering from what looks to be a diagnosis of 'discoordination'/discordance.

[Modus Ponens]

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsarticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyid=2006-02-07T152958Z_01_L07723729_RTRUKOC_0_US-RELIGION-CARTOONS-IRAN-HOLOCAUST.xml&rpc=22

[Joga]

This whole thing is ridiculous.

Even this thread is ridiculous. Yes, there are plenty of Muslim terrorists. Are all Muslims like that? No. To say that they all are is ignorant, and you know it. Hate breeds hate. NO country, religion, society, race, etc is free from that. We are no better than any of them. And, we are starting to allow a man to control our government based on his religious beliefs and agendas, so there you have it. The Muslims are not the only sheep.

Think what you will about Muslims. They have caused us a lot of grief. I will give you that, and will not deny the horrible things that happened here. But remember to put yourselves in the shoes of the people over there who fight us. Many of the civilians fight us because they know if they don't, they will be slaughtered by a corrupt government who threatens them into believing that they are fighting for a religious cause. Many of you are too young to remember or even know this, but during the Persian Gulf war, there were Iraqi troops surrendering to us because they knew that our government would take better care of them than their own government.

People make fun of God all the time. And, every time, there are religious groups trying to censor everything. Yes, I think that the paper running the contest is extreme, because I don't really think that the Holocaust is a laughing matter, but that's the whole point. Muslims don't believe that making fun of their leader is a laughing matter. Everyone is too touchy now. That goes for our own country, too. I'm sick of everyone censoring everything. It's getting out of hand.

[phi]

This whole thing is ridiculous.

Even this thread is ridiculous. Yes, there are plenty of Muslim terrorists. Are all Muslims like that? No. To say that they all are is ignorant, and you know it. Hate breeds hate. NO country, religion, society, race, etc is free from that. We are no better than any of them. And, we are starting to allow a man to control our government based on his religious beliefs and agendas, so there you have it. The Muslims are not the only sheep.

Think what you will about Muslims. They have caused us a lot of grief. I will give you that, and will not deny the horrible things that happened here. But remember to put yourselves in the shoes of the people over there who fight us. Many of the civilians fight us because they know if they don't, they will be slaughtered by a corrupt government who threatens them into believing that they are fighting for a religious cause. Many of you are too young to remember or even know this, but during the Persian Gulf war, there were Iraqi troops surrendering to us because they knew that our government would take better care of them than their own government.

People make fun of God all the time. And, every time, there are religious groups trying to censor everything. Yes, I think that the paper running the contest is extreme, because I don't really think that the Holocaust is a laughing matter, but that's the whole point. Muslims don't believe that making fun of their leader is a laughing matter. Everyone is too touchy now. That goes for our own country, too. I'm sick of everyone censoring everything. It's getting out of hand.

THANK YOU.

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsarticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyid=2006-02-07T152958Z_01_L07723729_RTRUKOC_0_US-RELIGION-CARTOONS-IRAN-HOLOCAUST.xml&rpc=22


"This is a test for the Muslim world to react immediately to condemn their own co-religionists in Iran for such obscene behavior as we condemned those who sought to insult them,"

I know that there are other Muslims who disagree with and who will condemn this Holocaust cartoon contest, as much as they disagree with all the terrorism. But I think this, all of this, is more than just a religious matter.

(I do find that contest ridiculous. I find that this 'act of retaliation' is more of an act of desperation.)

[Modus Ponens]

This whole thing is ridiculous.

Even this thread is ridiculous. Yes, there are plenty of Muslim terrorists. Are all Muslims like that? No. To say that they all are is ignorant, and you know it. Hate breeds hate. NO country, religion, society, race, etc is free from that. We are no better than any of them. And, we are starting to allow a man to control our government based on his religious beliefs and agendas, so there you have it. The Muslims are not the only sheep.

Think what you will about Muslims. They have caused us a lot of grief. I will give you that, and will not deny the horrible things that happened here. But remember to put yourselves in the shoes of the people over there who fight us. Many of the civilians fight us because they know if they don't, they will be slaughtered by a corrupt government who threatens them into believing that they are fighting for a religious cause. Many of you are too young to remember or even know this, but during the Persian Gulf war, there were Iraqi troops surrendering to us because they knew that our government would take better care of them than their own government.

People make fun of God all the time. And, every time, there are religious groups trying to censor everything. Yes, I think that the paper running the contest is extreme, because I don't really think that the Holocaust is a laughing matter, but that's the whole point. Muslims don't believe that making fun of their leader is a laughing matter. Everyone is too touchy now. That goes for our own country, too. I'm sick of everyone censoring everything. It's getting out of hand.

The difference is you don't see us rioting here in the states burning down buildings and killing people because someone painted a picture of Christ that resembled Bin Laden that's now hanging in a museum in NYC.

[Joga]

The difference is you don't see us rioting here in the states burning down buildings and killing people because someone painted a picture of Christ that resembled Bin Laden that's now hanging in a museum in NYC.

Yeah...I see us over in Afghanistan and Iraq, burning down buildings and torturing villages full of civilians because of the "Weapons of Mass Destruction" that we found everywhere.

[Modus Ponens]

Yeah...I see us over in Afghanistan and Iraq, burning down buildings and torturing villages full of civilians because of the "Weapons of Mass Destruction" that we found everywhere.

I'm talking the general populous here.

And we're in Afghanistan looking for OBL, not WMD.

I did not support going into Iraq but for different reasons than yours I'm sure. Saddam was the only thing keeping the Mullah's in check. Now that he's gone, they are trying to facilitate the return of their savior by inciting war with the western world.

[Joga]

I know that there are other Muslims who disagree with and who will condemn this Holocaust cartoon contest, as much as they disagree with all the terrorism. But I think this, all of this, is more than just a religious matter.

(I do find that contest ridiculous. I find that this 'act of retaliation' is more of an act of desperation.)

I agree completely. Many of the Muslims who are trying to start the new government of the Middle East are peaceful people who are just as anxious to get rid of Osama and Saddam as we are.

It is definitely more than just a religious matter. We've uprooted these peoples' lives. While I understand that the intentions are good, that doesn't make the process easy.

Many of the European countries have joined us in the fight against "terror," and it would be very upsetting to find that some of the countries that are supposedly supporting you are making fun of your religious leader. That would be like the US, hypothetically, agreeing to help Germany overthrow Hitler, and then photographing FDR wearing a swastika on his arm. I would be upset, too.

[Joga]

I'm talking the general populous here.

And we're in Afghanistan looking for OBL, not WMD.

I did not support going into Iraq but for different reasons than yours I'm sure. Saddam was the only thing keeping the Mullah's in check. Now that he's gone, they are trying to facilitate the return of their savior by inciting war with the western world.

Yep. That's the reason Bush has given us now. First, we were there looking for WMDs. When that didn't pan out, he changed his tactic. I find it hard to believe that the most militarily-developed country in the world can't track OBL down.

And, the general populus of your own great country rioted against itself just last fall. The victims of the hurricane decided to shoot against the very people who were trying to help them. So, our country is not void of people who kill for no reason.

[Modus Ponens]

Yep. That's the reason Bush has given us now. First, we were there looking for WMDs. When that didn't pan out, he changed his tactic. I find it hard to believe that the most militarily-developed country in the world can't track OBL down.

Don't confuse Afghanistan with Iraq. We went into Afghanistan for the sole purpose of finding OBL and eliminating those that protected/supported him. That was never a secret motive hidden under the guise of finding WMD's. And before you criticise our inability to find him, you should see what the conditions are like there. There are massive networks of caves (trapped) from the attempted Russian invasion.


And, the general populus of your own great country rioted against itself just last fall. The victims of the hurricane decided to shoot against the very people who were trying to help them. So, our country is not void of people who kill for no reason.

Human nature. People are so reliant on technology that when technology fails us on a large scale most people don't know how to survive. Then it becomes survival of the fittest.

[Joga]

Don't confuse Afghanistan with Iraq. We went into Afghanistan for the sole purpose of finding OBL and eliminating those that protected/supported him. That was never a secret motive hidden under the guise of finding WMD's. And before you criticise our inability to find him, you should see what the conditions are like there. There are massive networks of caves (trapped) from the attempted Russian invasion.

I understand why we're in Afghanistan, but there has to be a time when we finally realize that we don't have the resources to fund this expedition. If we keep it up at this rate, our children will not be educated past the eighth grade, because Bush keeps pulling money out of things here to fund a fight that we're not winning. The conditions are horrible. I agree with you. Which is exactly why we need those people over there to come home, and be with their families, instead of dying from carbombs and equipment malfunctions. The whole war has become stagnant. OBL is not coming out of hiding anytime soon. He's practically ancient at this point...and if he does come out of hiding, even better. It will be much easier to find him that way.



Human nature. People are so reliant on technology that when technology fails us on a large scale most people don't know how to survive. Then it becomes survival of the fittest.

So couldn't it also be said that it's human nature to defend your beliefs? Which includes pride...in religion? In your country?

[Modus Ponens]

I understand why we're in Afghanistan, but there has to be a time when we finally realize that we don't have the resources to fund this expedition. If we keep it up at this rate, our children will not be educated past the eighth grade, because Bush keeps pulling money out of things here to fund a fight that we're not winning. The conditions are horrible. I agree with you. Which is exactly why we need those people over there to come home, and be with their families, instead of dying from carbombs and equipment malfunctions. The whole war has become stagnant. OBL is not coming out of hiding anytime soon. He's practically ancient at this point...and if he does come out of hiding, even better. It will be much easier to find him that way.

I agree, we need to spend more resources towards education. But that money should be pulled in the form of budget cuts from the following:
All Faith-based intitiatives
Abstainance-only programs that have been proven failures
Tax cuts for the richest 1% of Americans
Tax cuts for outsourcing
War on drugs





So couldn't it also be said that it's human nature to defend your beliefs? Which includes pride...in religion? In your country?

Religion is man-made. Human nature is primal instinct imprinted in all of us.


Edit: We're at a pretty frightening crossroads globally. We're quickly approaching conflict on a massive scale and budget cuts in the military wouldn't be the brightest move right now. While I didn't favor the war in Iraq, it does provide a solid staging area for dealing with Iran. Iran's current leadership believes that they can speed up the return of Muhammed by instigating war with the western world. And what better way to do that than by flexing their nuclear "might" on someone like.......Israel? This isn't a case of a madman trying to hold a continent hostage for food (Kim in NK) but a bunch of lunatics HOPING and praying for all out war on a global scale. That's why something like MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) won't work with Iran if/when they get to the point of having nukes (if they don't already have them). The problem now is.....how long before China's pride kicks in and decides to bare their teeth? And what will Russia's response be? So with all of this to take into consideration do you really want to see us downsize the military?

[Joga]

I agree, we need to spend more resources towards education. But that money should be pulled in the form of budget cuts from the following:
All Faith-based intitiatives
Abstainance-only programs that have been proven failures
Tax cuts for the richest 1% of Americans
Tax cuts for outsourcing
War on drugs

I agree with all of that.






Edit: We're at a pretty frightening crossroads globally. We're quickly approaching conflict on a massive scale and budget cuts in the military wouldn't be the brightest move right now. While I didn't favor the war in Iraq, it does provide a solid staging area for dealing with Iran. Iran's current leadership believes that they can speed up the return of Muhammed by instigating war with the western world. And what better way to do that than by flexing their nuclear "might" on someone like.......Israel? This isn't a case of a madman trying to hold a continent hostage for food (Kim in NK) but a bunch of lunatics HOPING and praying for all out war on a global scale. That's why something like MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) won't work with Iran if/when they get to the point of having nukes (if they don't already have them). The problem now is.....how long before China's pride kicks in and decides to bare their teeth? And what will Russia's response be? So with all of this to take into consideration do you really want to see us downsize the military?

I don't want us to downsize the military. Not at all. But being that this is coming about, we need to think about what is more important. Dealing with a 150-year-old man with kidney failure who is holed-up in a cave somewhere, or dealing with the more global issue that you mention.

The problem is that our military is stretched too thin right now. Recruitment is down, and why wouldn't it be? After everything people have seen on TV, I don't know many people who are eager to sign up. Iran could do what they're doing at any time. A year. Five. Who knows? We need our military strong...not coming off of a two-year tour in the desert. Many of the people now are going to be able to retire from the service as soon as their Middle East tours are over, because their time was extended. So yes, I do think that our military needs to be strong. Downsizing now to strengthen us later seems like a much better idea, IMO. We do not need an entire country going after one man. We need to be ready for what could be really bad.

[B]

Mohammed,
Mo' Problems

LOL

[mud_]

if racism is intolerance of someone based on their race, whats it called when you're intolerant of someone based on their religion?

[KenKill75]

Religious people are the most unintelligent living beings in existence. Flame on.

[greg]

earth sux

[KenKill75]

I blame Muhammad, that cocksucker.

[magic marker]

That just shows how many muslims are unevolved, belligerant fucks.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f236/euphonae/p1.jpg

That is a great depiction of the muslim situation in the middle east.

Ignorant? Perhaps this is hypocrisy.

Muhammad = :shit:

I spy ignorance.

The fact of the matter is, you are not supposed to draw or make sculptures or any such thing of anything in islam, especially not of Muhammed. Even worse if you tried to do it to God (Even though God has physical form, and you cannot see him, according to Islam). The reason for it is before Islam, the area that persecuted them, the same way the Romans did the Christians, they worshipped idols. Statues. To prevent this from ever happening, to prevent them from worshipping false gods ever again, those were cut out of the religion.

So, picture a guy going into a church and taking a shit on the vatican's bed. It's roughly the same anger that ensues. There could be worse deeds done, but its still a big disrespect.

Just because you don't understand it, or the muslim world, you down play it. You make it look stupid. You hate it.

Totally evolved.

people shouldn't be surprised about the stupid-ass religious fanaticism around the world (completely specific to Islam and its primitive intolerance)

Do the same thing with a budda picture - I guarantee that Buddhists and Hindus will not spark any physical violence.

That's because the Buddhists themselves have put up statues and pictures everywhere. It's a well spread thing. Buddha isn't god in their religion, he's merely a man who opened their eyes. The Hindus have been worshipping statues for thousands of years.


like someone said on one of those sites that i got the picture from: its becoming more and more clear that there is NO way that these fucking morons will ever be (and i hate to use the word) "assimilated" into a RELATIVELY peaceful society

It depends on the areas you're talking about. Saudi Arabia is definitely a place you don't want to go, mainly because of Wahabism. Wahabism is a very skewed and corrupt form of islam that has taken over that area, by war. That's where all the terrible stereotypes come from. If you go to a place like Turkey, you'll be very surprised to find how beautiful and great it is. Bangladesh is also a good place. Palestine cannot even be considered because of sixty years of war.


i know. that shit makes me angry as hell

i want to print up a hundred copies and send it to every mosque i can find the address of

no doubt though i'd be charged for inciting a riot or some other soft cock bullshit like that

edit- i should have looked at yor link first, i thought you referring to the three danes that were killed in afghanistan over the cartoons

You take yourself too seriously to think that you would have an effect. Or perhaps you pack all muslims into your stereotype thats ineffective. I think if death threats still coming from the 9/11 days, and muslims being shot for things they didn't do and beliefs they don't hold are still continuing, a news story isn't going to do much of shit.

The difference is you don't see us rioting here in the states burning down buildings and killing people because someone painted a picture of Christ that resembled Bin Laden that's now hanging in a museum in NYC.

Thats because christianity doesn't ban pictures of christ. They hang statues of him dying on a wooden cross in almost every church. There's pictures of him, everywhere. He's on tv, being made fun of. People are used to it, as well. It's completely desensitized. Even if it was against their religion.


And we're in Afghanistan looking for OBL, not WMD.


Judging by our decisions in Afghanistan, we're doing SUCH a good job on that one, aren't we? I mean, we already let him slip through our fingers once. Oh oh! And before 9/11, we didn't even care about him, even though he punched a nice hole in one of our ships. He's TOP priority.

I agree, we need to spend more resources towards education. But that money should be pulled in the form of budget cuts from the following:
All Faith-based intitiatives
Abstainance-only programs that have been proven failures
Tax cuts for the richest 1% of Americans
Tax cuts for outsourcing
War on drugs

Religion is man-made. Human nature is primal instinct imprinted in all of us.

Edit: We're at a pretty frightening crossroads globally. We're quickly approaching conflict on a massive scale and budget cuts in the military wouldn't be the brightest move right now. While I didn't favor the war in Iraq, it does provide a solid staging area for dealing with Iran. Iran's current leadership believes that they can speed up the return of Muhammed by instigating war with the western world. And what better way to do that than by flexing their nuclear "might" on someone like.......Israel? This isn't a case of a madman trying to hold a continent hostage for food (Kim in NK) but a bunch of lunatics HOPING and praying for all out war on a global scale. That's why something like MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) won't work with Iran if/when they get to the point of having nukes (if they don't already have them). The problem now is.....how long before China's pride kicks in and decides to bare their teeth? And what will Russia's response be? So with all of this to take into consideration do you really want to see us downsize the military?

Return of.. Muhammed? Muhammed is the last messenger there will ever be, until Jesus comes back, according to Islam. No one believes Muhammed is coming back. They believe the same as the Christians.

If you're claiming all of these people are so terrible, yet you come up with statements like..

I blame Muhammad, that cocksucker.

And get yourselves all worked up, and upset, then how are you better? How are you different? You don't have religion, but you have misguided ideas, ignorance, and carelessness. How are you better? You aren't. You are exactly what you're saying the other is. You may not have the hope and morals of religion, but you have all the negatives. But yet you think you're so much above. You think you see the light of the situaution from a bird's eye view, when none of us can. You're failing, just like your stereotypes.

[KenKill75]

:laughing:

[KenKill75]

You spy ignorance? Spy this, dumbass. What I typed is called a joke. Learn the word, it might come in handy in the future. And the joke served the purpose of making a point. To kill for it is what is ignorant, not to make the joke. Offended or not, to kill people for a cartoon is clear evidence of people who arent playing with a full fucking deck. And defending it wouldnt make you appear much better. I couldnt care less if they pray to a picture of a toilet 24 hours a day. Thats their problem. They want to tell people it is wrong to ridicule it, fine, thats their choice, just like its people's choice to ridicule it. To kill because of it, that is the only ignorance I see here. So, kid, :stfu: and :gtfo: with your high horse preaching.

[magic marker]

You spy ignorance? Spy this, dumbass. What I typed is called a joke. Learn the word, it might come in handy in the future. And the joke served the purpose of making a point. To kill for it is what is ignorant, not to make the joke. Offended or not, to kill people for a cartoon is clear evidence of people who arent playing with a full fucking deck. And defending it wouldnt make you appear much better. I couldnt care less if they pray to a picture of a toilet 24 hours a day. Thats their problem. They want to tell people it is wrong to ridicule it, fine, thats their choice, just like its people's choice to ridicule it. To kill because of it, that is the only ignorance I see here. So, kid, :stfu: and :gtfo: with your high horse preaching.

Made a point? It didn't make a point at all. What we're talking about is beyond offended, its heresy. That makes a huge difference.

High horse preaching? You're about as full of shit as your point.

[dionysusolympus]

http://image.com.com/tv/images/video/south_osama_medvid.jpg

[KenKill75]

What is your point, genius? That its ok to kill someone who's made a blasphemous cartoon?

Im so tired of these fucking neo-hippies who think they know something about the world.

[magic marker]

What is your point, genius? That its ok to kill someone who's made a blasphemous cartoon?

Im so tired of these fucking neo-hippies who think they know something about the world.

The only thing I do know is my dad converted to Islam, and I grew up that way since 3rd grade. I've been around muslims from all over the world, and experienced some of the tragedy 2nd hand. I've gone on "missions" of sorts with them. So no, not a neo-hippy.

Not that its okay to kill them over it, but a little understanding before you go off and call them sand niggers. Though you and I know its wrong, its better to understand both sides. All you seem to want to do is press a pretty red button.

[KenKill75]

Im not pressing any buttons. As far as im concerned, this comes down to killing people over a cartoon. And im sorry, but doing that makes them sand niggers. Like I said, they can worship whoever or whatever they want, and as insensitive as the cartoons may be, killing people who made them is absurd, and inexcusable.

[magic marker]

Im not pressing any buttons. As far as im concerned, this comes down to killing people over a cartoon. And im sorry, but doing that makes them sand niggers. Like I said, they can worship whoever or whatever they want, and as insensitive as the cartoons may be, killing people who made them is absurd, and inexcusable.

For once you didn't attempt to insult me.

You're looking at bare bone people, but religion, though you and I may believe it to be false, has an amazing effect on people. Its basically like saying you didn't get insulted by me, you got insulted by letters and words. Like saying words have nothing to them but letters and sounds. It is very similar. These people are enraged. There's little to stop that. You may think its silly, but its not the silliest. People kill arabs every day for 9/11, when they have no relation to the event other than through a television.

[Modus Ponens]

Return of.. Muhammed? Muhammed is the last messenger there will ever be, until Jesus comes back, according to Islam. No one believes Muhammed is coming back. They believe the same as the Christians.


While the terminology may be off a bit the ideology that I'm pointing out is correct. A vast majority of Shi'a Islam (Iraq, Iran, Lebanon, Bahrain) are from the Ithna Asharia school of thought. This includes the leadership of Iran. Ahmadinejad believes he can speed up the return of the 12th Imam through war and chaos and he's done everything in his power to surround himself with like minded individuals. Are you going to try and dispute this?

[KenKill75]

If religion has the effect of causing people to kill, which we both know it does, then all that does to me is further prove the hypocrisy of religion as a whole, regardless of which religion it is. To me, the underlying point of this whole topic is that whether or not it is ridiculous to them, it is, in fact, ridiculous, and more importantly, unacceptable, to kill for this reason. If they believe so strongly in their religion, then they should believe that those people will be punished anyway, whehter they do anything about it or not. So again, clearly these people are not playing with full decks. And when I say "these people", im not talking about Muslims, im talking about ANYONE who would kill over these types of situations.

[magic marker]

While the terminology may be off a bit the ideology that I'm pointing out is correct. A vast majority of Shi'a Islam (Iraq, Iran, Lebanon, Bahrain) are from the Ithna Asharia school of thought. This includes the leadership of Iran. Ahmadinejad believes he can speed up the return of the 12th Imam through war and chaos and he's done everything in his power to surround himself with like minded individuals. Are you going to try and dispute this?

Perhaps you know of a powerful and numerous lot of christians with the same thoughts?

[magic marker]

If religion has the effect of causing people to kill, which we both know it does, then all that does to me is further prove the hypocrisy of religion as a whole, regardless of which religion it is. To me, the underlying point of this whole topic is that whether or not it is ridiculous to them, it is, in fact, ridiculous, and more importantly, unacceptable, to kill for this reason. If they believe so strongly in their religion, then they should believe that those people will be punished anyway, whehter they do anything about it or not. So again, clearly these people are not playing with full decks. And when I say "these people", im not talking about Muslims, im talking about ANYONE who would kill over these types of situations.

And you and I see that. But, these people have religion, we do not. To us it is unacceptable, to them it is. To them, they're protecting their faith, the most important thing in their lives by far.

They may be cartoons, but it is the meaning of the cartoons that matter.

[Modus Ponens]

Perhaps you know of a powerful and numerous lot of christians with the same thoughts?

That's why we have checks and balances unlike them where there rule is absolute. Nice try though.

[Modus Ponens]

And you and I see that. But, these people have religion, we do not. To us it is unacceptable, to them it is. To them, they're protecting their faith, the most important thing in their lives by far.

They may be cartoons, but it is the meaning of the cartoons that matter.

Freedom of speech.

[breastnorton]

Isn't Muhammad a prohpet though? It's not the same thing as Christ, but more like Buddha, which goes back to someone's point about Buddhists not flipping out if something similar happened.

But when it comes right down to it, people are rioting and killing based off a drawing. Certainly they see the drawing as disrespect, but that doesn't give the right to destroy and kill, and it does not mean we should forgive them for it or understand it at all.

You want to take a shit in a church? Go ahead. I'm pretty sure the christians who pray there would burn down the Iranian embassy and kill a few people because of it.

[magic marker]

Isn't Muhammad a prohpet though? It's not the same thing as Christ, but more like Buddha, which goes back to someone's point about Buddhists not flipping out if something similar happened.

But when it comes right down to it, people are rioting and killing based off a drawing. Certainly they see the drawing as disrespect, but that doesn't give the right to destroy and kill, and it does not mean we should forgive them for it or understand it at all.

You want to take a shit in a church? Go ahead. I'm pretty sure the christians who pray there would burn down the Iranian embassy and kill a few people because of it.

Yes, Muhammed was a prophet, the last prophet to be on earth until jesus comes back. Not like buddha for the fact that the buddhists made huge sculptures of buddha, and even a fat version of him, all over the east.

People are indeed killing over the simplest of things. But it makes me wonder. Do they even know how to protest in a small way anymore? There's so much killing, so much death going around, I wonder if thats all they really know how to do to make a point. Americans, we have had all sorts of peaceful protest and arguements through the years, but since french and english invasions, and recently russian, has it just become an acceptable method?

Whatever. I'm really done with this topic.

[breastnorton]

What I meant was that Muhammad is a prophet, not the son of God as we see Jesus. Buddha was the human form of perfection, so not quite in the same mold as Christ either. I just see Muhammad being a lot closer to Buddha than anything else. Buddhists having tons of scultpures and depictions of Buddha is just a difference in belief, though of course Buddha is not seen as holy in any way.

[KenKill75]

And you and I see that. But, these people have religion, we do not. To us it is unacceptable, to them it is. To them, they're protecting their faith, the most important thing in their lives by far.

They may be cartoons, but it is the meaning of the cartoons that matter.


But my point is that regardless how they see it, the fact of the matter is, murder is illegal. Its not just to us that its unacceptable. It is only to madmen that it is acceptable. You can be an extremely religious person and you can be highly offended and outraged by all this, but if you're not a raving lunatic, you wont go murdering these people. Unfortunately, it seems there are more extremists among this particular religion than in others. Thus the stereotype. Like it or not, stereotypes exist for a reason. No, they dont apply to everyone within a group, but they apply to enough people within that group for the stereotype to exist.

[Keith Moon]

- I think that --.-.-....-.-.-.-.. and therefore .-.....-..-..- cause you're only just .-.-.-------.-.---..-.... which is .-...-.--... but .----....-. lol .-..-.-.-.-.-.-. ---.-.-. .-.--. and :nsmyken:, which is just wrong, however .--.----...-.-.-....-.

[KenKill75]

:jazzgreg:

[Keith Moon]

- :boo:

[KenKill75]

:jihadlol:

[Keith Moon]

- :captlol2:

[KenKill75]

Fuck your capt

[Tertius Oculum]

Silly people, Muhammad has no face!

[Joga]

But my point is that regardless how they see it, the fact of the matter is, murder is illegal. Its not just to us that its unacceptable. It is only to madmen that it is acceptable. You can be an extremely religious person and you can be highly offended and outraged by all this, but if you're not a raving lunatic, you wont go murdering these people. Unfortunately, it seems there are more extremists among this particular religion than in others. Thus the stereotype. Like it or not, stereotypes exist for a reason. No, they dont apply to everyone within a group, but they apply to enough people within that group for the stereotype to exist.

Then Bush must be a madman, because the war in the Middle East has murdered plenty of innocent people.

EDIT: And everyone, please cool it with the name-calling and insulting.

[paygee]

Then Bush must be a madman, because the war in the Middle East has murdered plenty of innocent people.

ya think?!!?!?

[Joga]

Well definitely...I was just showing my side of things to ken...

[paygee]

i know, i just couldnt help myself

[mud_]

And you and I see that. But, these people have religion, we do not. To us it is unacceptable, to them it is. To them, they're protecting their faith, the most important thing in their lives by far.
They may be cartoons, but it is the meaning of the cartoons that matter.


thats a bullshit cop out
its no excuse whatsoever for anything
Hitler, among hundreds of others involved in genocide, were just"protecting their faith"
Koresh, among several others, held their faith as the most important thing in his life.

ahh...i see what your saying, we should UNDERSTAND them...perhaps even offer a bit of forgiveness or at the very least just ignore it?

:rolleyes:

[KenKill75]

Then Bush must be a madman, because the war in the Middle East has murdered plenty of innocent people.

EDIT: And everyone, please cool it with the name-calling and insulting.

Im quite sure we could argue the reasons for us being in the Middle East until the end of time, but im sorry Jess, I dont quite think its a very good analogy to compare us retaliating after thousands of people were killed right here in my city for absolutely no reason whatsoever to people killing over a cartoon. You dont like Bush, thats fine. You dont like war, thats fine. But that comparison doesnt work for me.

[Joga]

It has nothing to do with liking Bush or liking the war. Murder is illegal. Yes. But we are not able to sit here and say that our murder is okay because it's in response to reason A, while other people murdering folks is not okay because it's in response to reason B. To me, that is Bush playing God, and that is not acceptable.

I'm not denying that what happened in NYC was horrible. I would never say that. What I do find horrible is that we condemned it so much, and families lost loved ones, yet now we're doing the same thing to innocent people, civilians, in other countries. People who just go about their day, minding their own business, trying to survive in a country with a really messed-up government. Do you see what I'm saying? We're going out and doing the same thing we condemned them for. Yes, we're doing it in retaliation. I understand your argument. But that doesn't make it right for us to kill other innocent people. All it does is inflame the situation, and starts a never-ending cycle of violence. Do you really think this war will make them stop? It's all about pride, just like it is with us. All this war is doing is fanning the flames. I hope it leads to freedom for those in the small countries we are helping, but Al Qaeda is still alive and well, and they're angry.

Anyway, there is no way either of us will ever convince the other of our position, so yeah. I'm just putting it out there. I really don't want this to turn into a big thing.

[KenKill75]

Im not turning it into a big thing. Its just a discussion. But war always has and always will exist, and to single out Bush, I think, is a bit unfair. I could respond to the rest of your post, but im a little busy at work at the moment. :hug2:

[Joga]

I know you're not turning it into a big thing...I just know that you and I are both, should I say, outspoken when it comes to our beliefs...and I think we both know what it could turn into, if we choose to let it...

:hug2:

[KenKill75]

Can we have sex now?

[Joga]

k.

[Keith Moon]

- :FF:

[Joga]

- :FF:

Come here, big boy. :smooch:

[Keith Moon]

- :woo:...:nanner25:

[Modus Ponens]

It has nothing to do with liking Bush or liking the war. Murder is illegal. Yes. But we are not able to sit here and say that our murder is okay because it's in response to reason A, while other people murdering folks is not okay because it's in response to reason B. To me, that is Bush playing God, and that is not acceptable.

I'm not denying that what happened in NYC was horrible. I would never say that. What I do find horrible is that we condemned it so much, and families lost loved ones, yet now we're doing the same thing to innocent people, civilians, in other countries. People who just go about their day, minding their own business, trying to survive in a country with a really messed-up government. Do you see what I'm saying? We're going out and doing the same thing we condemned them for. Yes, we're doing it in retaliation. I understand your argument. But that doesn't make it right for us to kill other innocent people. All it does is inflame the situation, and starts a never-ending cycle of violence. Do you really think this war will make them stop? It's all about pride, just like it is with us. All this war is doing is fanning the flames. I hope it leads to freedom for those in the small countries we are helping, but Al Qaeda is still alive and well, and they're angry.

Anyway, there is no way either of us will ever convince the other of our position, so yeah. I'm just putting it out there. I really don't want this to turn into a big thing.


War is ugly and it is brutal. There's no other way to put it. And I dislike the idea of war as much as you but there is alot of good that can come from it. But there's something you need to take into consideration concerning loss of innocent life...........a vast majority of innocent lives lost during this war have been due to suicide bombers. We're talking upwards of 97% (fact). Our weapons are unbelievably accurate. The level of sophistication we're operating at is borderline sci-fi. This helps keep our own soldiers out of harms way during missions. The problem we have is policing the area due to an enemy that can't be picked out of a crowd. But this isn't the sort of thing that gets reported by the media.

Here's an example of something you'll never see in the news. A friend of ours stationed in New Mexico "pilots" one of our Predator drones in Afghanistan. A few weeks ago after some extensive recon they had intel on the location of a group of Al-Qaeda operatives near the Pakistani border. Rather than sending in troops, giving away their position, he had orders to take them out with the drone. Turns out there were 37 operatives turned into a fine red mist by someone sitting in a chair on the other side of the world. Pretty good days worth of work that doesn't get reported.

[dionysusolympus]

Well definitely...I was just showing my side of things to ken...

that's hott!

:hump3:

[wesdgreat]

This whole thing is ridiculous.

Even this thread is ridiculous. Yes, there are plenty of Muslim terrorists. Are all Muslims like that? No. To say that they all are is ignorant, and you know it. Hate breeds hate. NO country, religion, society, race, etc is free from that. We are no better than any of them. And, we are starting to allow a man to control our government based on his religious beliefs and agendas, so there you have it. The Muslims are not the only sheep.

Think what you will about Muslims. They have caused us a lot of grief. I will give you that, and will not deny the horrible things that happened here. But remember to put yourselves in the shoes of the people over there who fight us. Many of the civilians fight us because they know if they don't, they will be slaughtered by a corrupt government who threatens them into believing that they are fighting for a religious cause. Many of you are too young to remember or even know this, but during the Persian Gulf war, there were Iraqi troops surrendering to us because they knew that our government would take better care of them than their own government.

People make fun of God all the time. And, every time, there are religious groups trying to censor everything. Yes, I think that the paper running the contest is extreme, because I don't really think that the Holocaust is a laughing matter, but that's the whole point. Muslims don't believe that making fun of their leader is a laughing matter. Everyone is too touchy now. That goes for our own country, too. I'm sick of everyone censoring everything. It's getting out of hand.
:cool: :cheers: :bravo:

[Modus Ponens]

Ahmadinejad: Israel 'will be removed' (http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/breakingnews.php?id=78985)

Tehran (dpa) - Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on Saturday that the Palestinians and "other nations" will eventually remove Israel from the region.

Addressing a mass demonstration in Tehran - one of many organized throughout Iran to commemorate the 27th anniversary of the Islamic revolution - he once again questioned the Holocaust "fairy tale".

"We ask the West to remove what they created sixty years ago and if they do not listen to our recommendations, then the Palestinian nation and other nations will eventually do this for them," Ahmadinejad said in a ceremony marking the 27th anniversary of the Islamic revolution.

"Do the removal of Israel before it is too late and save yourself from the fury of regional nations," the ultra-conservative president said. He once again called the Holocaust a "fairy tale" and said Europeans have become hostages of "Zionists" in Israel.

He also accused Europeans for not allowing "neutral scholars" to investigate in Europe and make a scientific report on "the truth about the fairy tale of Holocaust."

"How comes that insulting the prophet of Muslims worldwide is justified within the framework of press freedom, but investigating about the fairy tale Holocaust is not?" Ahmadinejad said.

"The real Holocaust is what is happening in Palestine where the Zionists avail themselves of the fairy tale of Holocaust as blackmail and justification for killing children and women and making innocent people homeless," Ahmadinejad said.

The president said that the results of the parliamentary elections in Palestine and the victory of the Hamas group "clearly showed what the people really want."

"You (the West) want democracy but do not respect the outcome," Ahmadinejad said, referring to the election results in Iraq and Palestine.

"It seems that you (the West) only want that form of democracy whose results just repeat your standpoints and only follow your policies," he said.

Ahmadinejad once again called on the West to adopt the "simple option" and allow Palestinians to voice their political will through a referendum.

Mass demonstrations organized by the state were held throughout Iran on Saturday as the nation commemorated the 27th anniversary of the revolution that established the Islamic Republic in Iran.

According to state media, hundreds of thousands of people came into the streets to show their solidarity with the government over pursuing the country's nuclear programmes and voice their protest against publication of cartoons deemed insulting to the Prophet Mohammed.

While chanting "Death to America", "Death of Israel" and "Nuclear energy is our undisputable right", the crowd walked toward the Azadi (Freedom) Square in Tehran where Ahmadinejad held his annual speech.

In his speech the Iranian president warned that in case of harsh measures against Tehran over its controversial nuclear programme, the country would revise its commitment toward the Nuclear Non- Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

"The policy of Iran has so far been pursuing nuclear technology within the framework of the NPT and IAEA (International Atomic Energy Agency)," he said.

"But if you (the West) continue efforts to deprive the Iranian nation from this (nuclear) right, then we would reconsider this policy," he warned.

Ahmadinejad asked the crowd in the Azadi square to tell the world its message and show its willingness to continue the nuclear programmes despite Western pressure.

"The era of military force is over, today is the era of nations, logic and worshippers of God," the president said.

He also referred to remarks by United States President George W. Bush who had said that the Iranian people were different from the Islamic government in Tehran, saying there was no distinction.

"Look, this is the third generation standing here and they are even more religious, more informed, more enthusiastic and more resistant (than the first generation) to defend the ideals of the revolution," Ahmadinejad said.

The president also referred to the cartoons and called it a "Zionist plot" against not only Muslims but also those genuinely committed to Christianity and Judaism.

"Those who insulted the prophet should know that you cannot obscure the sun with a handful of dust. The dust will just get back and blind your own eyes," he said.

The crowd replied to his remarks with "Death to Denmark" slogans.