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Heath
June 22nd, 2005, 06:25 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050622/ap_on_go_co/flag_burning

WASHINGTON - A constitutional amendment to outlaw flag burning cleared the House Wednesday but faced an uphill battle in the Senate. An informal survey by The Associated Press suggested the vote there could be close.

The 286-130 outcome was never in doubt in the House, which had passed the measure or one like it five times in recent years. The amendment's supporters expressed optimism that a Republican gain of four seats in last November's election could produce the two-thirds approval needed in the Senate as well after four failed attempts since 1989.

But an AP survey Wednesday found 34 senators on record as opposing the amendment — the exact number needed to defeat it, barring a change in position. Democratic Sens.
Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York and Ken Salazar of Colorado declined to state their positions Wednesday.

House debate fell along familiar lines over whether the amendment strengthened the Constitution or ran afoul of its free-speech protections.

Supporters said there was more public support than ever because of emotions following the 2001 terrorist attacks in New York and Washington. They said detractors are out of touch with public sentiment.

"Ask the men and women who stood on top of the Trade Center," said Rep. Randy (Duke) Cunningham, R-Calif. "Ask them and they will tell you: pass this amendment."

Critics accused the amendment's supporters of exploiting the attacks to trample the right to free speech.

"If the flag needs protection at all, it needs protection from members of Congress who value the symbol more than the freedoms that the flag represents." said Rep. Jerrold Nadler (news, bio, voting record), D-N.Y., whose district includes the site of the former World Trade Center.

The last time the Senate voted on the amendment the tally was 63 in favor and 37 against, four votes short of the two-thirds majority needed.

Now, with more than two dozen new members, a four-seat Republican gain in the last election and a public still stung by the terrorist attacks in 2001, activists on both sides say the Senate could be within a vote or two of passage.

But the amendment's prospects faded late Wednesday when Democratic Sens. Maria Cantwell of Washington and Mark Pryor of Arkansas revealed that they would oppose it.

Possible presidential contenders who have supported the amendment in the past include Evan Bayh, D-Ind., Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tenn., Chuck Hagel, R-Neb., and John McCain, R-Ariz.

Sen. Joseph Biden (news, bio, voting record), D-Del., a likely presidential candidate, has said he would oppose the amendment.

The proposed one-line amendment to the Constitution reads, "The Congress shall have power to prohibit the physical desecration of the flag of the United States." For the language to be added to the Constitution, it must be approved by two-thirds of those present in each chamber, then ratified within seven years by at least 38 state legislatures.

The amendment is designed to overturn a 5-4 Supreme Court ruling in 1989 that flag burning is a protected free-speech right. That ruling threw out a 1968 federal statute as well as flag-protection laws in 48 states. The law was a response to anti-Vietnam War protesters setting fire to American flags at demonstrations.

The Senate could consider the measure as soon as next month.

___

Associated Press Writer Jim Abrams contributed to this report.

___

The amendments are S.J. Res 12 and H.J. Res 10.

Tzarina
June 22nd, 2005, 08:57 PM
these are such silly things to waste this time and effort upon. those damn senators and congressman go get drunk at lunch and come back all riled up like a possee of fucking red necks, then i bet they vote... fucking idiots... and who ARE these idiots that initiated this...
cause yea what we need are more damn laws...no.

i'm too pissed off about my pictures to continue this rant...

Raynoch11
June 23rd, 2005, 11:37 AM
This will never pass the Senate, and if it did, the states won't ratify it.

They've tried 5 other times since the Supreme Court case and none of them have worked.

Pun'KinG'
June 23rd, 2005, 11:54 AM
I really don't see a problem with it...





as long as it's the Canadian flag. :what:

Tzarina
June 23rd, 2005, 01:17 PM
This will never pass the Senate, and if it did, the states won't ratify it.

They've tried 5 other times since the Supreme Court case and none of them have worked.
do you really think so? they just seem so unpredictable that i don't know what to expect :shrug:

Raynoch11
June 23rd, 2005, 01:21 PM
do you really think so? they just seem so unpredictable that i don't know what to expect :shrug:
The hardest thing to do in the US is to amend the constitution. I doubt they'll come anywhere near getting the required amount of states to ratify. A lot of states won't even look at the matter.

The idea that people are attemptint to silence protests like this is a little unsettling though.

dirty clown
June 23rd, 2005, 02:38 PM
"Ask the men and women who stood on top of the Trade Center," said Rep. Randy (Duke) Cunningham, R-Calif. "Ask them and they will tell you: pass this amendment."

Critics accused the amendment's supporters of exploiting the attacks to trample the right to free speech.


Fuck you, man. How would you know? I'm pretty sure if you asked them antyhing their answer would probably be, "HELP ME! GET ME OFF OF THIS BUILDING BEFORE IT COLLAPSES!" or "HOW DID THOSE GUYS ACCOMPLISH THIS? WHY WASN'T SECURITY BETTER?"

They exploit 911 for anything they want. It's like on the Daily Show: "911 + whatever we say= shut the fuck up"

Heath
June 23rd, 2005, 02:41 PM
I think someone needs to remove the stick that is lodged in his ass. It isn't my opinion, it's the article. I'm completely against the amendment, and exploiting people who died to pass it.

dirty clown
June 23rd, 2005, 02:45 PM
Yeah, that "Fuck you" was directed at the politician, not you. Sorry about that.

:peace:

Tzarina
June 23rd, 2005, 02:46 PM
The hardest thing to do in the US is to amend the constitution.
we don't need to amend the constitution though, they just get around it... we can see this with drug laws... :shrug:

Heath
June 23rd, 2005, 02:46 PM
No problems. I just assumed, after seeing my name at the top of the quote.

:bj:

Tzarina
June 23rd, 2005, 02:48 PM
Fuck you, man. How would you know? I'm pretty sure if you asked them antyhing their answer would probably be, "HELP ME! GET ME OFF OF THIS BUILDING BEFORE IT COLLAPSES!" or "HOW DID THOSE GUYS ACCOMPLISH THIS? WHY WASN'T SECURITY BETTER?"

They exploit 911 for anything they want. It's like on the Daily Show: "911 + whatever we say= shut the fuck up"
this is actually very true and funny :up:

Heath
June 23rd, 2005, 02:50 PM
Let's just sit around and jizz on each other while we watch the country go down the shitter.

dirty clown
June 23rd, 2005, 02:55 PM
Waaaay ahead of you.

Tzarina
June 23rd, 2005, 02:58 PM
Let's just sit around and jizz on each other while we watch the country go down the shitter.
i made a post yesterday in the flag thread about the drunk redneck congressman :lol:

that is how i feel... not necessarily sit around, but it's all about getting for themselves irregardless of it's effect on people or the nation overall :shame:

and it's at all levels of politics, from the local to world wide... such a very sad state of affairs...

and it's like the normal person sits around and thinks..."as long as i can afford my dakota truck, beer, and WWF...it all must be goooood..."
:rolleyes2

paygee
June 23rd, 2005, 03:16 PM
i made a post yesterday in the flag thread about the drunk redneck congressman :lol:

that is how i feel... not necessarily sit around, but it's all about getting for themselves irregardless of it's effect on people or the nation overall :shame:

and it's at all levels of politics, from the local to world wide... such a very sad state of affairs...

and it's like the normal person sits around and thinks..."as long as i can afford my dakota truck, beer, and WWF...it all must be goooood..."
:rolleyes2
dont forget nascar tickets

:ontome:

Pun'KinG'
June 23rd, 2005, 03:17 PM
Fuck you, man. How would you know? I'm pretty sure if you asked them antyhing their answer would probably be, "HELP ME! GET ME OFF OF THIS BUILDING BEFORE IT COLLAPSES!"

:crying:"Phew! It's getting pretty hot in here. Anybody else feel warm?"

"If this is what it feels like to be a burning American flag then I would support any amendment in the near or distant future to outlaw this behavior."



I need to sleep. :zzz:

paygee
June 23rd, 2005, 03:18 PM
all this flag burning talk makes me want to burn a flag, and hang it on a cross

Pun'KinG'
June 23rd, 2005, 03:23 PM
dont forget nascar tickets

:ontome:

NASCAR drivers don't get tickets. They're supposed to speed. :rolleyes:

paygee
June 23rd, 2005, 03:25 PM
NASCAR drivers don't get tickets. They're supposed to speed. :rolleyes:
youre so clever :rolleyes:

dirty clown
June 23rd, 2005, 03:25 PM
:ha:

Pun'KinG'
June 23rd, 2005, 03:42 PM
youre so clever :rolleyes:

And you're quite perceptive to my cleverness. :rolleyes:

Tzarina
June 23rd, 2005, 03:50 PM
all this flag burning talk makes me want to burn a flag, and hang it on a cross
and burn that too :nuke:


:tank:

paygee
June 23rd, 2005, 04:06 PM
And you're quite perceptive to my cleverness. :rolleyes:
thats it


:bash:

Heath
June 23rd, 2005, 05:05 PM
Well, if I was going to burn something, I'd burn a red, white and blue cross with flags draping from it, while riding around in cirlces on horseback.

Tzarina
June 23rd, 2005, 05:22 PM
don't forget to wear a sheet :what:

paygee
June 23rd, 2005, 05:32 PM
no i dont want and sheets or horses or front yards invovled, just good old flag burning

Heath
June 23rd, 2005, 05:33 PM
Not even the White House front yard?

paygee
June 23rd, 2005, 05:33 PM
Not even the White House front yard?
well maybe

Tzarina
June 23rd, 2005, 07:14 PM
Not even the White House front yard?
what could we burn into the front yard of the white house lawn?

:uhhh:

Heath
June 23rd, 2005, 08:46 PM
A giant rebel flag?

A penis?